Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

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Joel Bottomley
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Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Joel Bottomley »

Has anyone used this XDF? I can't get any changes from the fuel of timing tables. It seemed to me the XDF was set to the wrong size, 32 not 16k, the data looks fine but I get no modification, I'm using an Ostrich. I usually do Holdens without many issues.
spd_tolis
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by spd_tolis »

Joel Bottomley wrote:Has anyone used this XDF? I can't get any changes from the fuel of timing tables. It seemed to me the XDF was set to the wrong size, 32 not 16k, the data looks fine but I get no modification, I'm using an Ostrich. I usually do Holdens without many issues.
and me i have this problem......plese help!!!!!!
bmwconnect
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Post by bmwconnect »

Most of the XDF's on tunerpro are not correct. You pay for what you get and in this case it's not much. People pay me to make correct XDf's cause it is very time consuming.

All the best
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aboutton
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Post by aboutton »

The idea behind this forum is helping people for free and for a good tuner the xdf will not consume that much time.

Joel Bottomley send me your car's file and i will create 1 for you

FOR FREEEEEEEEEEEEE :wink:
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Tony Ouneissy
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bmwconnect
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Post by bmwconnect »

When you are guessing about the information it take's no time ;)
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aboutton
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Post by aboutton »

bmwconnect wrote:When you are guessing about the information it take's no time ;)
Do i know you ? or do you even know me ? please don't judge me before you know me.
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Tony Ouneissy
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DmcL
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Post by DmcL »

im surprised barrie still hasnt been banned from here yet. hes like a cockroach on tuning sites. leeching files and re-selling as his own and when customers have problems with what he sells them he blames everything (including the customer) but himself.

i wouldnt send him any files or buy anything from him. i dont post much here and when i do i dont talk about anything thats not already fairly widely known. i dont feel free to share info/findings/etc with greedy eyes about..

its a shame really because id be updating my 173 XDF thats already up in the downloads section and adding XDF's for other E30 ECU's as/when i make or update them.
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Post by evilm3666 »

I got hosed by Barrie for $280 dollars for a "hpx blow through map and xdf"
I got the 60lb 803 maf tune that is floating around the net with the maf table jacked up and a xdf with all the rpm break points not matching the bin.
I won`t have said anything but when he is trashing on someone else s work. That is wrong. If this needs to go further I still have the emails and the files.
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Post by DmcL »

tbh its nothing new.. been happening for years. me and a few others were banned from his forum years ago around the time he started the business and ofcourse after we all posted plenty of files/info..

it really sucks because i dont want to share things here or on any site hes on. i wouldnt mind it so much but i got into the DIY tuning thing for myself and to help others working on similar ECU's, i also have a business these days but im forever answering emails/questions about this that and the other and 99.9% of them do not result in a sale of any kind. not good for business for me but i hate to turn people away if i can help. maybe i need a paypal donate button? lol
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Mangus
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Post by Mangus »

It'd be fabulous if aboutton could assist Joel with the issue (without money crossing hands, in the spirit of this software and the original DIY community goals). If that's possible, please move forward with that and stay on topic. If positive results occur, please send me the corrected files and I'll happily post them.

bmwconnect, please keep your posts constructive. If you're unable to assist, refrain from posting. Thanks.

(FWIW, most of my time in this hobby is also spent "in the weeds" in email. It's the nature of the beast.)

I appreciate that you guys are helping each other out!
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mproved88
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help with .xdf

Post by mproved88 »

I have recently read the stock BIN file from my e30 m3 071 ecu I need help creating and xdf file
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aboutton
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Post by aboutton »

mproved88 send me your original bin and i will create an xdf for you
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Tony Ouneissy
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mproved88
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Post by mproved88 »

I attempted to send email to one you provided but it will not go through
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aboutton
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Post by aboutton »

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Tony Ouneissy
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aboutton
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Post by aboutton »

mproved88 the XDF file for your car is sent to your inbox, enjoy

NB: The file provided on this forum and created by Raul the Aryan has nothing wrong in it, but the bin file has 8 fuel part throttle maps and 8 ignition part throttle maps and the XDF originally provided shows only 2 maps for ignition and fuel so i have showed you in my XDF the rest of the maps, load the XDF and the bin and do a trace to find out the maps used by the ECU.

good luck
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mproved88
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Post by mproved88 »

Thank you I will keep you posted after data trace
Josue_M3
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Post by Josue_M3 »

Hi, I have read the eeprom intalled in my car (ecu 0216200071 green) and tryed the s14 xdf but it seems to be not the right one for this bin, could somebody help me with a xdf? any help would be much apreciated
Asterypsilon
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Thread Revamping M3 320is e30 xdf and maps

Post by Asterypsilon »

Good Morning,

I'm attaching my .xdf for M3 e30 EVO0, 1 and 2 and 320is, with stock maps (16kb) and DAMOS.
https://www.ecuconnections.com/forum/vi ... fb63badb77 (you need to register).
It all works with Tuner Pro latest version.

I'm no professional tuner nor electronic specialist.

When opening .xdf, "READ" means that the ECU is reading the relative map (the Tuner Pro tracing function lights up).
I don't know if that means that the ECU is ignoring other maps or that Tuner Pro tracing function doesn't work for some reason.
Among the INJ/ADV WOT maps I spotted, one for sure is used, but I forgot to sign it "READ".

There are a lot of "Unknowns"... Some map names are translated from the german DAMOS.

I tested four ECUs, two 087 and two 071 equipped with different stock maps.
All ECUs use the same addresses when reading maps: e.g. 31E8 for the injection correction 256 pojnts (rpm/load) hot engine map.
Don't know the reason of the 8 adv 256 points map and 8 inj 256 points map, when just four (hot/cold both adv and inj) are used and always at the same addresses.
S14B20&23pack.zip
(37.93 KiB) Downloaded 643 times
Updated xdf below, added some parameters and breakpoints, now orderly in-line with tables.
Attachments
S14B20&23pack-only-xdf-update.zip
(17.33 KiB) Downloaded 658 times
Last edited by Asterypsilon on Mon Dec 12, 2022 11:23 am, edited 8 times in total.
Zaldiero
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Zaldiero »

I feel my English but I had to use the google translator.
I have a bmw e30 M3 with the 2.3 engine. I installed a MAF Miller with its corresponding chip but now with the engine cold the engine stops and with the electric fan running the idle is irregular.
Can somebody help me? Can't find the engine temperature corrector?
I have both original and Miller bins.
Can someone pass Damos?
ROM Originles.zip
Original y Miller Bin
(13.66 KiB) Downloaded 715 times
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Zaldiero wrote: Sat Dec 03, 2022 12:39 pm I feel my English but I had to use the google translator.
I have a bmw e30 M3 with the 2.3 engine. I installed a MAF Miller with its corresponding chip but now with the engine cold the engine stops and with the electric fan running the idle is irregular.
Can somebody help me? Can't find the engine temperature corrector?
I have both original and Miller bins.
Can someone pass Damos?
The Miller map is way different from the stock one.
First of all they modified the AFM transfer function (to fit the BOSCH pot = total different input voltage = load calculation) and the descriptor, which means the ECU will read maps at different addresses.
I can study the map, but I don't know when.
The best thing to do is to ask Miller for correct setup.
Where are you from?
When did you buy Miller setup?
Last edited by Asterypsilon on Mon Dec 05, 2022 11:59 am, edited 3 times in total.
Zaldiero
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Zaldiero »

I am from the north of Spain.
I sent a message to miller but he did not answer me
More or less I have located several maps but I don't see any that take into account the engine temperature for injection.
As for the purchase, I made it 3 years ago but with the pandemic and the fact that I use the car very much, the installation was carried out a year and a half ago.
The irregular idle could be the idle regulator not opening enough. What surprises me the most is that it stops cold since it is not solved with the same conditions. Sometimes it stops 2 times in the first 3 minutes and the third time you start the idle it stabilizes.
Other times due to traffic it does not stop in 5 minutes and the 1st traffic light stops. It seems like the car stalls on the 1st start and then with the following starts it gets rid of the extra gasoline.
I'll keep reading the maps to see if I can do something
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Zaldiero wrote: Mon Dec 05, 2022 11:50 am I am from the north of Spain.
I sent a message to miller but he did not answer me
More or less I have located several maps but I don't see any that take into account the engine temperature for injection.
As for the purchase, I made it 3 years ago but with the pandemic and the fact that I use the car very much, the installation was carried out a year and a half ago.
The irregular idle could be the idle regulator not opening enough. What surprises me the most is that it stops cold since it is not solved with the same conditions. Sometimes it stops 2 times in the first 3 minutes and the third time you start the idle it stabilizes.
Other times due to traffic it does not stop in 5 minutes and the 1st traffic light stops. It seems like the car stalls on the 1st start and then with the following starts it gets rid of the extra gasoline.
I'll keep reading the maps to see if I can do something
After a quick look at Miller map it looks that Miller used an M3 EVO2 map as base for alpha-n tuning, while your engine map is an "EVO 0" (standard M3) one.
So it seems you're running alpha-n on the wrong map which maybe, very maybe is causing your problems.
For starters, try the map attached. I rewrite some tables (not the alpha-n related) copying the standard M3 ones.
It's a 32kb for 27C256 eprom (like the maps you posted).
Attachments
BMWm3 miller27c256-1.zip
(6.93 KiB) Downloaded 655 times
Zaldiero
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Zaldiero »

THANKS A LOT
I will try as soon as possible but I have to get the chips and have an acquaintance lend me the programmer. When I have done it, I will post the result. What has caught my attention is that you call Alpha-n and I understand that the Alpha-n system is a direct intake system and I installed and replaced the AFM with a hot wire MAF
And I say it again THANK YOU VERY MUCH
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Zaldiero wrote: Tue Dec 06, 2022 1:58 am THANKS A LOT
I will try as soon as possible but I have to get the chips and have an acquaintance lend me the programmer. When I have done it, I will post the result. What has caught my attention is that you call Alpha-n and I understand that the Alpha-n system is a direct intake system and I installed and replaced the AFM with a hot wire MAF
And I say it again THANK YOU VERY MUCH
No: "alfa-n system" is to remove the AFM and replace the stock throttle position switch with a potenziometer ("pot"): "alpha" is throttle angle, n is rpms. You may use a triple action pot (which tells the ECU when idling, partial throttling, WOTting), like Miller alpha-n.
I thought it was alpha-n cause the AFM transfer function in the map has been changed, which makes sense when using a pot, less sense when using a MAF, like 6WK9605 /05Z, with which you can start the car and drive with way less mapping.
So, Miller sells a MAF conversion too? I didn't know. Their website seems down.
However, the .bin above keeps all Miller's updates for the "new sensor" unchanged and, in addition, align the map itself to a standard M3 e30 engine (not EVO2).
But I can't guarantee anything (including engine/car, or your, safety) - I had to say that :)

Did you check the car? Maybe problems are not the maps. Faulty MAF?

Let me know.

Bye.
Zaldiero
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Zaldiero »

I understand what you say about alpha -N but I bought a Miller E30 M3 Mass Air Flow Conversion System,
I am attaching all the information I have. As for testing your map when I have done so, I am of the opinion. That if 1st I have to get the programmer and the eprom
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1W162KB ... sp=sharing
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Zaldiero wrote: Tue Dec 06, 2022 10:58 am I understand what you say about alpha -N but I bought a Miller E30 M3 Mass Air Flow Conversion System,
I am attaching all the information I have. As for testing your map when I have done so, I am of the opinion. That if 1st I have to get the programmer and the eprom
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1W162KB ... sp=sharing
Ok.
Let's see if my map works.
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Asterypsilon
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M3 E30 Motronic Injection Constant Load Computation - Something more than maybe.

Post by Asterypsilon »

Sorry for those who DLed the Excel since now.
It was wrong.

To look for the real Load value @ idle, while engine running, you just lower the "Maximum Load" constant to the point the mixture starts to lean out.
The idle Load is just above that value. The point is that my Excel was showing higher values cause I didn't get this https://s4wiki.com/wiki/Load into account.

So: Load=Q/(n*K*0.5)/SM where SM is the Standard Mass: using this formula Excel numbers are really close to emulation ( and in points different than idle too).
What's left is the same as before: for any Volt(V) input you get the Transfer Function Q(g/s) number, while "n" is rpm and "K" (g/s) the injection constant.

V->Q is from the abused Rogue_Ant (from Renlist) excel: same V->Q as in the FR Wilk (RIP) former website.
K is calculated by http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/i ... 745.0;wap2 .

Don't know exactly what motronic is M3 E30 EMS: somewhere is ML3.1 (087 and 071 ECU, older), other - professional too - M1.something (newer), but more often ML 3.1 which is FR Wilk conclusion (and cope with FR Wilk reported TF).
Don't know if K is stored in the EPROM either, but getting K in L formulas makes the real time L emulation close to theoretical numbers.

IF M3 E30 EMS is ML3.1 and V->Q, K formula are correct:
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________
K:

Cilynders 4
AFR target 14.70
Injector flow rate (cc/min) 236.50
Injector flow rate (g/min) 177.38
Correction for heptane number (g/min) 186.24 (=177.38*1.05)

K (g/min) = 4*14.70*186.24 = 10951.13


Load:

Flow rate (lets assume @ idle), @ ~1V -> Q = 5,67 g/s

SM = 2300 * 0.00122521 = 2.82 g

Load @ 800 rpm =5,67/(800*10951.13*0.5)/2.82*3600000 = 1.65ms (3600000 is from units adjusting).

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________
Repeating for each Q and rpm you get the L table in the attachment (made an assumption on gas density 0.75 g/cc).

ECU would pick any L number from 1.05ms (min load value - EPROM) to 9.35ms (max load value - EPROM) in the L table and corrects L @ Partial Throttle (PT) from 1.00ms (?why less than 1.05ms?) to 6.40ms (min/max Load Breakpotins in PT map), corrects for ide and WOT anywhere in the min/max load values range when the Throttle Position Switch (TPS) switches (regardless AFM output) by the idle and WOT maps (rpm breakpoints only).
Emulation/AFR monitoring shows that to lower Maximum Load constant to 7ms is not leaning the mixture @WOT on the entire rev band to limiter on a new s14b23 and a stock (200cv dyno) healthy (tested) AFM. Setting the max load @ 6.35ms leans out from 5000 rpm: eventually the increasing AFM output @ WOT while revving - flap opening - would mean at some point the engine asking for more L (6.35ms x WOT correction table).
The maximum max Load programmable is 12.75ms (stock 9.35ms), the Load Table ends @ 9.28ms (5V AFM output).

Don't know if the injection constant is the FQS (Fuel Quality Switch) values in the EPROM.

UPDATE (Wide Open Throttle):

Emulation confirms that when @ WOT (WOT switch active) the Load coming from the formula above is multiplied by the factors in the WOT correction table (rpm dependent): if computed L is above the max load constant value, ECU will cut it to that value, but again, @ WOT, multiplying it by the WOT factors:

1000 1.24
1480 1.3
2000 1.36
2480 1.27
3000 1.35
3480 1.41
4000 1.35
4480 1.39
4760 1.38
5000 1.34
5520 1.31
6000 1.29
6240 1.24
6480 1.19
6760 1.15
7000 1.09


So, if setting max load to 6.35ms leans the mixture past 5000 rpm @ WOT, it means that 6.35ms x WOT correction (from 5000 rpm on) leads to an L insufficient to feed the engine properly.
Here is what should be the actual L (not considering other ECU corrections) @ WOT when lowering the max load from 9.35ms to 6.35ms (the red is where the engine leans out):

rpm load(ms)
1000 7.874
1480 8.255
2000 8.636
2480 8.0645
3000 8.5725
3480 8.9535
4000 8.5725
4480 8.8265
4760 8.763
5000 8.509
5520 8.3185
6000 8.1915
6240 7.874
6480 7.5565
6760 7.3025
7000 6.9215


And follows, again, actual L @ WOT, but setting max load = 7ms, mixture not leaning past 5000 rpm:

1000 8.68
1480 9.1
2000 9.52
2480 8.89
3000 9.45
3480 9.87
4000 9.45
4480 9.73
4760 9.66
5000 9.38
5520 9.17
6000 9.03
6240 8.68
6480 8.33
6760 8.05
7000 7.63

So, considering that Partial Throttle (PT) Load breakpoints are from 1,00 to 6,40 ms and that 7ms max load is sufficient for a smooth/rich AFR @ WOT, I'd say that L numbers are below the 7ms threshold, before any ECU correction [?].
Here:
https://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=39721
Maybe multiplication precedes addition: e.g. Acceleration Enrichments and Warmup & Hot Enrichments factors seem to be additive because (differently from PT and WOT table values) setting them to zero does not make the engine stall.

UPDATE (Partial Throttle).


Did some other tests.
Changing Load breakpoints in the PT table will make ECU pick correction factors in a different column than stock, and, changing the rpm breakpoints, in a different row.
The ECU computes Load e.g. 3.40ms @ 3000 rpm and applies the correction factor place in the 10th column (3.40) & 8th row (3000).
If you modify the stock Load breakpoints [1.00 (1) 1.20(2) 1.40(3) 1.60(4) 1.80(5) 2.00(6) 2.30(7) 2.60(8) 3.00(9) 3.40(10) 3.80(11) 4.30(12) 4.80(13) 5.30(14) 5.80(15) 6.40(16)] moving 3.40 e.g. in the 7th column, the correction factor @ 3.40 and 3000 is picked in the 7th column (instead of the stock 10th) and 8th row.
Moving 3000 out of its stock position (8th row) will make the ECU look in the new row (not 8th anymore).
Attachments
TF-M3-STOCK-corrected.zip
(146.14 KiB) Downloaded 424 times
Asterypsilon
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Re: Alfa (Alpha) - N Conversion M3 E30 320is Eprom

Post by Asterypsilon »

Find attached: the map (AN.bin) suitable for the conversion, XDF (TunerPro), Icar.exe (free 2D map visualizer), the very same formulas excel sheet AN-TF.xls (as above, but updated for a better reading experience), EGT recordings bmp, dyno test and an assembly picture.

I'm using the 0280120418 (A) to replace the stock throttle position switch and the 0280130039 (B) as the air temperature sensor.

(A) is a double action sensor (potentiometer + switch) equipped with a nice connector which perfectly fits the stock throttle position switch plug.
(B) resembles quite closely the output of the stock ATS inside the AFM assembly (tested by amateur means: heat gun and thermocouple).

The wiring connecting A+B to the stock AMP (5 poles female junior power timer connector) by an easy to find male 5 pins AMP is left to the voracious reader.

Engine temperatures after conversion during operation (partial throttle, WOT) have been checked by 4 termocoulples in the stock exhaust and occasional knocking by a knock sensor bolted on the block: and all of that comparing to the stock config to avoid issues.

The dyno test (attached) is from a stock 2.3L with EVO 2 cams, without the carbon airbox, and it compares two runs: one with a cone filter fitted on the stock plenum by a 90° 110mm hose and the second with the stock AFM and airbox installed (but disconnected), both on the same AN map; it is useful to see what actually changes by removing the AFM.

As always, I'm no professional, you're free to use what above at your own risk ;)

https://s14net.vbulletin.net/forum/s14/ ... ost1323018

UPDATE:

I forgot to say that the stock eprom I used for the AN conversion is the standard M3 E30 2.3 (not EVO), checksum 5C9A: thus the .bin won't work on the 320is E30 (maybe you'll get idle and warmup problems).

I can post the 320is map here, on request.
Attachments
AN.part03.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 199 times
AN.part02.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 210 times
AN.part01.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 228 times
Last edited by Asterypsilon on Thu May 23, 2024 10:00 pm, edited 6 times in total.
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

Continue...
Attachments
AN.part06.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 229 times
AN.part05.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 220 times
AN.part04.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 208 times
Last edited by Asterypsilon on Thu May 09, 2024 12:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
Asterypsilon
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2022 7:44 am

Post by Asterypsilon »

Continue...
Attachments
AN.part07.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 204 times
AN.part09.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 214 times
AN.part08.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 210 times
Last edited by Asterypsilon on Thu May 09, 2024 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
Asterypsilon
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Re: Motronic 071 ecu M3 E30 s14

Post by Asterypsilon »

End.
Attachments
AN.part11.rar
(7.33 KiB) Downloaded 223 times
AN.part10.rar
(200 KiB) Downloaded 224 times
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